AutoX Event #4 & 5 (May 12th and 13th)

[NevadaSTi]

OK, I just checked weather.com for the this weekend's forecast, and its suppost to be 74 and 75 degrees with partly cloudy on Sunday. Of course we are 5 days out from the event.

I heard a rumor that a certain freshly painted Camaro is going to be running for the first time at this event. I have a picture of it on my cell phone, but I won't steal the thunder by posting a pic of it.

I also see that according to the schedule, our very own MattR and SPERRY our the event chairs. So, is there any teasers of the cource to be had?

Also, do you need our (SECCS) help with setting up the course on Friday?

I am looking forward to the upcoming weekend. Although, at this time I am not sure I am going to be running my Smoke-stang.

[MattR]

You got hte date wrong, the event is this weekend, the 12th and 13th.

Yes, we will probably need a few sets of hands to aid with set up friday. I'm not sure what time yet though, I will let everyone know.

[Kevin M]

This weekend isn't the 19th and 20th. ;)

[Nick Koan]

Can't wait for the warmer temperatures.

Just as long as they aren't too warm :p

[MattR]

All I can say is that the course will crush all your hopes and dreams.

[Kevin M]

So it is anti-power and anti-handling? Sweet, I have a chance! :lol:

[NevadaSTi]

Sorry about the dates, thanks to whomever fixed it.

[JonnydaJibba]

I need tires HELLA bad. So I might come to hang out cuz Tim will be there, but probably not.

[ScottyS]

Teh April?

[Nick Koan]

So it is anti-power and anti-handling? Sweet, I have a chance! :lol:

There are even going to be cones you are required to hit.

[dknv]

All I can say is that the course will crush all your hopes and dreams.Slaloms!
I just hope it's not alot of tight corners requiring downshifts to 1st.

Also would be nice to have some elements we can practice with, (for those who are going to Hawthorne).

[Nick Koan]

Teh April?

Eh, those dates are right, give or take a month.

[NevadaSTi]

In my original post, I put it like this. AutoX #4 & 5 (19th and 20th) So, someone else put in the April part.

[Kevin M]

There are even going to be cones you are required to hit.

:banana:

[NevadaSTi]

So it is anti-power and anti-handling? Sweet, I have a chance! :lol:

If its anti-power, that would be a super short coarse with a continous turn? If its anti-handling, then it would imply that its a straight shot from start to finish. ALA, Drag racing. IMO, drag racing has a lot to do with power and nothing about handling. So, it would be a contradiction in terms to have a anti-power and anti-handling coarse.

Am I confused???

[ScottyS]

There are even going to be cones you are required to hit.

Cone molestation FTW

http://www.scottystrachan.com/hosted/SCCA/slides/DSCF2606.JPG

[Nick Koan]

If its anti-power, that would be a super short coarse with a continous turn? If its anti-handling, then it would imply that its a straight shot from start to finish. ALA, Drag racing. IMO, drag racing has a lot to do with power and nothing about handling. So, it would be a contradiction in terms to have a anti-power and anti-handling coarse.

Am I confused???

You're not confused. You just explained why Kevin put the lol smiley at the end of his post.

[cody]

So it is anti-power and anti-handling? Sweet, I have a chance! :lol:

A staring contest?

[dknv]

Also, do you need our (SECCS) help with setting up the course on Friday?Also wouldn't hurt to plan on helping with setup on Sat. morning or packing up Sunday late afternoon....

[MattR]

Also wouldn't hurt to plan on helping with setup on Sat. morning or packing up Sunday late afternoon....

Yes Indeed....I would prefer help saturday AM and Sunday night above all else! :D

The course is going to be a surprise, and I'm hoping it will be high speed with major transitions.

[MPREZIV]

I'll be there early on Saturday fo' sho'!


Oh yeah, and since we're on the topic, any word on moving SM to blue group, or still nothing yet?

[MattR]

No word yet, we'll have to make any adjustments the day of the event. If we're making any permanent moves, it will come after this weekend.

[MPREZIV]

Cool. Thanks Matt. I know everybody's been bugging the hell out of you about it...

[Dean]

I got nothing better to do, so just let me know when you want help on Fri.


I plan on RNPing in the afternoon both days. If anybody want me to drive their car for a lap or 2 to give you some ideas on how to attack the course and what your car can really do, I'd be happy to.

Any time I'm not driving other's cars, you are welcome to ride in mine. The first 3 runs during competition are also open for rides.

I'm happy to coach anyone as long as they are enough cars away in my group or in a different group assuming we have enough workers for me to be novice chief again.

[wrxkidid]

yea. let me know for friday too im up for helping. im gonna be there early and run all day saturday then run in the mornings sunday. my mom wants to ride along on sunday. so matt make the course real fast haha.

is a UTQG of 140 AA still alright for street tire or does that make it a r-comp? what is the cutoff? im looking at the Potenza RE-01R 245/40/17. if they are in-stock in reno can i just pick them up instead of paying for shipping?

[Bob Danger]

My Wallet feels a little lite so I think I'm going to pass.

[Kevin M]

yea. let me know for friday too im up for helping. im gonna be there early and run all day saturday then run in the mornings sunday. my mom wants to ride along on sunday. so matt make the course real fast haha. for AutoX is a UTQG of 140 AA still alright for street tire or does that make it a r-comp? what is the cutoff? im looking at the Potenza RE-01R 245/40/17

140 is the cutoff. RE-o1Rs are legal and arguably the fastest current street tire for heavier cars like Evos.

[Dean]

Potenza RE-01R 245/40/17. if they are in-stock in reno can i just pick them up instead of paying for shipping?Despite Kevin's comments on the RE-01s, the Advan's are the proven tires on heavier cars. Please see my thread on this topic (http://seccs.org/forums/showthread.php?t=5359).

If you want to spend 2X on tires, I'd go with those.

Bang for your buck though, I'd still get the 615s at 1/2 the price from Utah, save the tax, etc... The can be here in 1-2 days from Vulcan in Utah. And you can get 255/40-17s assuming you have the fender clearance for them as well as at least an 8" wheel.

[Nick Koan]

255/40/17 615s are on back order at Vulcan Tire... :mad:

Or at least they were last week when I looked. Supposedly a refresher should hit mid-late May though, so they should be in stock fairly soon.

[wrxkidid]

i was thinking about running the 615s as well. i can run the 255/40/17 they will clear. when i get some coilovers i might have to roll my fenders but no big deal. rolled fenders i can clear 285/30/18 r comps :sneaky:

nick they are in stock i just checked. they are 550 shipped here. ~ the same price the bridgestones were with the scca discount.

what now? haha. 615s run wide iirc so isnt a 255 ~ 265 which would be a much greater contact patch than the RE-01s in 245 right? or am i just confusing myself and others :lol:

[JonnydaJibba]

My Wallet feels a little lite so I think I'm going to pass.

Yeah that too.

[Dean]

Wow, the Bridgestones have come down that much? Including TAX? And since when do we get a SCCA discount from where?

[Kevin M]

Despite Kevin's comments on the RE-01s, the Advan's are the proven tires on heavier cars. Please see my thread on this topic (http://seccs.org/forums/showthread.php?t=5359).

After discussing the topic briefly with Debbie and Mark, the Advan prevalence in STU last yearseems to be directly related to the limites availability of sizes early last year for the RE-01s, and the significantly better contingencies offered by Yokohama.

[Kevin M]

i was thinking about running the 615s as well. i can run the 255/40/17 they will clear. when i get some coilovers i might have to roll my fenders but no big deal. rolled fenders i can clear 285/30/18 r comps :sneaky:

nick they are in stock i just checked. they are 550 shipped here. ~ the same price the bridgestones were with the scca discount.

what now? haha. 615s run wide iirc so isnt a 255 ~ 265 which would be a much greater contact patch than the RE-01s in 245 right? or am i just confusing myself and others :lol:

Frankly, we have no idea what you can clear on an Evo, espcially with aftermarket wheels.

All of the tires we are discussing here run wide. Check Tire Rack for the exact physical size of the Bridgestones and the Yoks.

[bruspeed]

Me and my Pops (Louie) will be there. Potentially with a few spectators in tow to watch the maiden voyage :eek:

[wrxkidid]

well the 245/40/17 RE01s w/ roadhazard from tirerack and tax picked up from the reno warehous are $700. an evo guy on another forum said theres a 100$ rebate offered by bridgestone to scca members. im trying to find out more about it.

kevin 255/40/17 is pretty much the limit w/ no rubbing on stock 17x8 wheels which i have so im not worried about any fitment. a bunch of guys told me to run the 615s for dd at that size and said they fit and dont rub.

[Kevin M]

Khamis says the RE01Rs are even better for daily use than the Falkens. And he's a big pansy about road noise and ride quality, so he's probably right. :p

[Kevin M]

Wait, don't evos run 245/45R17s stock?

[wrxkidid]

no 235/45R17s. to not rub on a wider tire than that you have to run a 40 profile.

[Dean]

Khamis says the RE01Rs are even better for daily use than the Falkens. And he's a big pansy about road noise and ride quality, so he's probably right. :pKhamis drives a stocker wagon not his STI. :P

[Kevin M]

Khamis drives a stocker wagon not his STI. :P

What, he uses the wagon to tow his STi to Hayward?

[MikeK]

Khamis drives a stocker wagon not his STI. :P

Which proves Kevin's point!

I have 2 autoX days and about 100 street miles on the RE-01Rs and they are noticably better than the RE-070s or the 615s. hey did fade a bit on my last few runs on sunday when they got really hot, but cold they are the best tyre I have driven on.

It will be interesting to see what they are like by the end of the season. The RE-070s weren't too bad when they got old and worn, but the 615s sucked balls (not in a good way).

[wrxkidid]

if they are at 140 that still leaves me in street tires right.

[MikeK]

yes

[wrxkidid]

sweet.

[Libila]

I´m landing in San Francisco Friday night so I might be there Saturday like Jonny said. I´m not sure about Sunday though... The whole Mother´s Day thing and me not being home for a year I think I´m required to spend the day with the Momz.

[cody]

Yeah, AutoX on Mom's Day FTL. :(

[Bob Danger]

I´m landing in San Francisco Friday night so I might be there Saturday like Jonny said. I´m not sure about Sunday though... The whole Mother´s Day thing and me not being home for a year I think I´m required to spend the day with the Momz.

eah, AutoX on Mom's Day FTL.

You chumps, just do what I did, and take your mom autocrossing. That way she thinks your spending the day with her when your really doing what you want to do.

[Nick Koan]

I spent the last two mothers days going to visit my mom, and was planning on doing that again. But, this year they wanted to come up for the Reno River Festival and so I'm free to race on Sunday!

[cody]

Sick!

[MattR]

My Mom moved to hawaii so the race is on! hahaha.

[Forgotten]

I took my Mom out to lunch today, so I may try to do both morning and afternoon both saturday and sunday depending on how worried I am about finals.

[sperry]

I saw my Mom last weekend in lieu of this weekend.

[cody]

I saw my Mom last weekend in lieu of this weekend.

So did I! ;)

[dknv]

You chumps, just do what I did, and take your mom autocrossing. That way she thinks your spending the day with her when your really doing what you want to do.Yay for you!
Bring them out, let them know there are some moms there who autox who really enjoy it, and see if they want to get in for a ride, or even give it a try themselves. Tell them I, as a Mom, said it's very liberating.

But at the very least if you don't see her on Sunday - give her a call and let her know you really appreciate her.

[NevadaSTi]

But at the very least if you don't see her on Sunday - give her a call and let her know you really appreciate her.

Thats all I have to do. My Mother lives far far away.

[MPREZIV]

I can see my Mom's house from the tarmac at Stead. I'll just take a drive up to see her after the event. :D

[Pat R.]

There's also an event in PHX on Saturday. If you're sick of the cold weather up there come on down- its supposed get up to 105° here.

[JonnydaJibba]

Its' been 80 all week!

[MPREZIV]

There's also an event in PHX on Saturday. If you're sick of the cold weather up there come on down- its supposed get up to 105° here.

I did a track event when I was down there at PIR with the Bondurant school... it was 117*. Feck. I'm SO GLAD to be back in Reno... Except I miss Angie and Jimmy's sub shop... If you haven't been there Pat, I HIGHLY suggest it!!!

[Pat R.]

I did a track event when I was down there at PIR with the Bondurant school... it was 117*. Feck. I'm SO GLAD to be back in Reno... Except I miss Angie and Jimmy's sub shop... If you haven't been there Pat, I HIGHLY suggest it!!!


¿Dónde está?

[MPREZIV]

IIRC, it's at Indian School and about 35th avenue... From I17, head west on Indian School, and it's on the right hand side. Order the Italian Cold Cut Sub. it's making me hungry just thinking about it...

[NevadaSTi]

Any Sacromento ringers coming?

[Joeyy]

Any Sacromento ringers coming?

Wait, the corvette guys are still complaining even though there is a BSP Corvette at the top of the pack? On race tires, no less. -NevadaSTI
__________________


Take a look at his address. He's going for the PAX title.

[dknv]

Any Sacromento ringers coming?I wonder too. The bay area autox forum has a thread that they are wondering why there are no events down there this weekend, and someone posted that there is an event up here.

[Joeyy]

Slaloms!
I just hope it's not alot of tight corners requiring downshifts to 1st.

Also would be nice to have some elements we can practice with, (for those who are going to Hawthorne).

I helped set up the course today. It doesn't look like I'll be doing any downshifts to 1st but thats what I said last event. See you all tomarrow.

[M3n2c3]

I won't make it this weekend. Possibly not next event, either (right next to my wife's bday = no money or time). I don't know if I'll make it to more than one or two events this year.

I'm thinking about selling my subzeros and azenis in order to fund a few other little bits.

[Joeyy]

Link to my first run on Sat. Man was I slow.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Hjev2j2O7zY

And one more...faster but eat a cone in the outside of the finishing curve.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AxQMyqAPTEY

[M3n2c3]

Link to my first run on Sat. Man was I slow.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Hjev2j2O7zY

Wow, hurry up and wait, huh? A 3 minute vid for 50 seconds of autox. :lol:

[Libila]

I'll post some of the pictures from today when I get a card reader. From what I can see on the two inch screen they look good but I was only able to get the first run group before I got kicked off the course.

[cody]

I'll post some of the pictures from today when I get a card reader. From what I can see on the two inch screen they look good but I was only able to get the first run group before I got kicked off the course.
Oh was that you that got kicked off the course? I was at station 6 with the big guy that kicked you off. Yah, you gotta get a spotter next time. Can't wait to see the pics.

Happy Mom's day all you Mothers. :P

[Libila]

I had a spotter for the first run group and I was coming over to six to ask if one of you guys would spot me but that guy wasn't having any of it. Oh well, I just napped in Pete's car instead.

[wrxkidid]

and got harassed by my mom. :lol:
whats up man.

[Dean]

I had a spotter for the first run group and I was coming over to six to ask if one of you guys would spot me but that guy wasn't having any of it. Oh well, I just napped in Pete's car instead.Corner worker <> spotter. You have to have your own, the corner workers already have a job... :)

[MPREZIV]

Car crapped on me today... Saturday was not bad at all tho! Overall, a good weekend!

[cody]

What's wrong with your car Cory?

[Forgotten]

Corner worker <> spotter. You have to have your own, the corner workers already have a job... :)

I'm sure the corner he went to needed all 6 workers.

[Dean]

Congratulations to MikeK for beating an old man by .001 seconds today in SM. I knew I should have taken the walker out of the trunk to save weight. :P

What is really funny is that we tied in PAX. :lol:

Subbies really represented today. Congrats everyone.

Cory, what's up with the car? I can recommend a good mechanic. :)

It was good to see the rolling money pit out there today. ;) It will be interesting when Scott gets his car dialed in.

[Dean]

I'm sure the corner he went to needed all 6 workers.Not the point. It is not the photographer's call. It is the Safety Steward's. He needed to ask before doing, not the other way around.

If we have excess workers and you ask the safety steward, they might be willing to pull someone from a corner. But not asking will get you in trouble every time. That is all I'm trying to say.

[A1337STI]

I didn't expect that big of a drop from yesterday. But getting 6 runs in was Awesome! :cool:

[Dean]

Oh, and most importantly, Thanks Matt and Scott!!!

[A1337STI]

Yes many thanks, great event today!

[Kevin M]

Oh, and most importantly, Thanks Matt and Scott!!!

Werd!

[Nick Koan]

Yeah. Awesome course both days Matt and Scott. I had a lot of fun.

I'm just glad I got my groove back and was able to be sorta competitive again.

[MattR]

I had a lot of fun today, thank you to Dean, Nick, Kevin, Derrick, Mike, Cory and others for all the help this weekend.

[Libila]

Dean, I was looking for the Safety Steward that I spoke to before the first run group but he was nowhere to be found once the second run group started. That's why I walked to six since they had so many people.

No worries though.

[Kevin M]

In the second group Helen Perry was the Safety Steward. In the future you could also look for the Event Chair(s) directly if you can't find the orange vest.

[Joeyy]

How did the afternoon go and what did the times look like?

[MPREZIV]

My F*ing car is doin' some strange stuff. It feels like the fuel pickup is running dry, but the car has 1/4 tank in it. I checked for leaks and such, nothing. The only other time it did it was event 1 when Scott and I were driving, and it had 1/4 tank then too... I've had more than that at every event since, including Saturday, and had no problems, but when it's at 1/4, if I find myself accellerating out of a fast corner, the engine cuts out. It really feels like fuel slosh, but I didn't think I'd be able to slosh it THAT bad, even at 1/4 tank. That's the only thing I can think of tho, since it won't do it at 1/2 tank. Looks like I will need to run more fuel from now on...

[MPREZIV]

Oh, and I do need to add a BIG thanks to Scott and Matt for an awesome course! That was a TON of fun guys! And no thanks needed for the help Matt, I'm just glad things went smoothly!

[dknv]

Adding another round of applause for all the work from Matt, Scott, Carrie, all the SECCS folks out there who put in extra effort to make the weekend. And, one of my best Mothers Day, ever!

[A1337STI]

Strange Cory.

I started below the 1/4 mark and My low fuel light came on during my last run or maybe 2nd to last and i didn't have any problems. Although i don't like being that low on gas so I plan on showing up with at least 3/8's of a tank in the future. but at my skill level i don't think the weight is much of a factor.


Oh and Joey,

The yellow (300ZX?) 13 EM had some more oil come off it on its first run. it was smoking at the line for its 1st and 2nd runs. I heard something about it being oil on the rails on the radio, but it was windy and I never asked the owner afterwards what really happened.

So there was a small delay on starting for the kitty litter and sweeping. and part way through some weird small green bugs flew in and started to annoy everyone. Then came my turn to drive. :) Lots of fun! I found the course challenging but also really fun! I think my best was a 47.4 something, and i got beat with a 46.x something . not quite sure what the Karts were running i know i saw one 40 but i don't know if that was a slow or quick time for them. (or if that run was clean)

[Dean]

My F*ing car is doin' some strange stuff. It feels like the fuel pickup is running dry, but the car has 1/4 tank in it. I checked for leaks and such, nothing. The only other time it did it was event 1 when Scott and I were driving, and it had 1/4 tank then too... I've had more than that at every event since, including Saturday, and had no problems, but when it's at 1/4, if I find myself accellerating out of a fast corner, the engine cuts out. It really feels like fuel slosh, but I didn't think I'd be able to slosh it THAT bad, even at 1/4 tank. That's the only thing I can think of tho, since it won't do it at 1/2 tank. Looks like I will need to run more fuel from now on...If it was in/after either the tank slapper tight section, or more likely the right hand sweepers, I'd lean towards a dry pickup issue.

We had quite a few heavy acceleration right handers on Sunday. Was it a clockwise course when you and Scott had problems?

[Forgotten]

I really had fun this weekend. Saturday left me really frustrated becuase the course was super tough to get a grasp on, especially with only 4 runs. Sunday was awesome though. Thanks again Matt & Scott. It's good to be back in SM :D

[cody]

I really had fun this weekend. Saturday left me really frustrated becuase the course was super tough to get a grasp on, especially with only 4 runs. Sunday was awesome though. Thanks again Matt & Scott. It's good to be back in SM :D

My sentiment's exactly. :)

[Nick Koan]

Adding another round of applause for all the work from Matt, Scott, Carrie, all the SECCS folks out there who put in extra effort to make the weekend. And, one of my best Mothers Day, ever!

Happy Belated Mothers Day. I meant to say something yesterday, but it slipped my mind. Rachel is looking faster and faster out there every event.

[NevadaSTi]

Happy Belated Mothers Day. I meant to say something yesterday, but it slipped my mind. Rachel is looking faster and faster out there every event.


Being a parent, I can't imagine a better gift for Mother's / Father's day then to be able to spend the day doing something you love to do with your child.

[dknv]

Being a parent, I can't imagine a better gift for Mother's / Father's day then to be able to spend the day doing something you love to do with your child....And your child liking/loving it too. This morning she asked me when the next autox was, when I told her it was Memorial Day weekend, she says, "darn - I can't wait". :lol: Thanks to everyone who is encouraging her on!

Interesting re: fuel cutout -- John Burns, the #38 kart driver, said he was having a problem with his fuel system this weekend too. Though I realize karts are alot different from subarus, and Dean's explanation makes alot of sense.

Green bugs - we were out at station 5 during group 3, those were really annoying!! For the longest time I couldn't find a place to stand where they weren't swarming. I think I might've brought a couple of them home with me too, blech.

[Nick Koan]

Green bugs - we were out at station 5 during group 3, those were really annoying!! For the longest time I couldn't find a place to stand where they weren't swarming. I think I might've brought a couple of them home with me too, blech.

Those guys were everywhere. They attacked me in the morning at registration too.

I think it was maybe a first for Stead, but I was actually hoping the wind would pick up and blow those little guys away. :lol:

[MPREZIV]

If it was in/after either the tank slapper tight section, or more likely the right hand sweepers, I'd lean towards a dry pickup issue.

We had quite a few heavy acceleration right handers on Sunday. Was it a clockwise course when you and Scott had problems?

Yep, I'm leaning towards that, due to the nature of the incident. Both times it's happened, it's been a clockwise course, and it's happened coming out of a high speed RH increasing radius corner, and only when the car's near 1/4 tank. As I pick up speed out of the corner, power cuts. Seems pretty simple, I just really didn't think my car would be able to do that to itself! Guess I'm pushing it harder than I thought! :D

[NevadaSTi]

...And your child liking/loving it too.

Your lucky your daughter is old enough to drive or take a ride along, my son is only 5. When I told him that I sold my STI he was like, "DAAAAAD, ugh!" Then he told me he was sad that I sold my race car. That bummed me out more then anything.

[MattR]

Results are up at renoscca.com

3rd place PAX FTMFW!

[Nick Koan]

Results are up at renoscca.com

3rd place PAX FTMFW!

Nice, I saw that. Congrats.

I got 15th in PAX, which is think is one of highest finishes in PAX (with a sizeable crowd anyway).

[Joeyy]

Results are up at renoscca.com

3rd place PAX FTMFW!

Good one!..

[Nick Koan]

Good one!..

You too man. 8th in PAX is awesome.

[Kevin M]

I held on to 24th for Sunday, and I'm actually pretty pleased with that. :lol:

[cody]

Apparently I wasn't there Sunday. :( I'll PM Mike.

[Pat R.]

It looks like Gary Starr is getting a handle on the Z06.

[MPREZIV]

Dammit I sucked on Sunday! :lol: Still holding 4th in SM Pax... until Pete comes and kicks my ass...

[NevadaSTi]

Apparently I wasn't there Sunday. :( I'll PM Mike.

I guess I didn't race on Sunday either!!!

HuH?

[cody]

I guess I didn't race on Sunday either!!!

HuH?

Send a PM to MikeK. He told me he'd be able to take care of it.

[MikeK]

The fixed results are done, Scott should have them on the website sometime soon. I have no idea where the lost numbers went. I am really sorry about the fuckup, I will be checking for this in the future :oops:

Cody, you were 3rd in ESP and 23rd in PAX

Brian, you were 6th in ESP and 38th in PAX

[cody]

Thanks Mike!

[NevadaSTi]

Thanks man. Do we know if we were the only people who inadvertantly left out?

[sperry]

Thanks man. Do we know if we were the only people who inadvertantly left out?
Because the guy that wrote the timing software is a hack programmer.

...results are updated on www.renoscca.org.

[Dean]

Because the guy that wrote the timing software is a hack programmer.

...results are updated on www.renoscca.org.While I agree the guy is a hack, the data loss might be attributed to the old version we are running. The author can only fix issues he is made aware of.

[cody]

Thanks Scott!

[sperry]

While I agree the guy is a hack, the data loss might be attributed to the old version we are running. The author can only fix issues he is made aware of.
I don't have the 3 hours it would take to list the known errors in that pile. Nor would I want a fix, since every new version reintroduces bugs, since Vitek's never heard of regression testing. I'd rather just figure out our own work-arounds to allow us to get the minimum data we need from the event to use as input to Mike's scoring software.

[MikeK]

I just checked the site for updates to the timing software, the next version is pre-release, look what I found in the release notes:
Potential Program Lockups - the software could exhibit an infinite wait state (deadlock) and possibly corrupt the staging file in extreme cases. These problems were reproduced only under very high stress loads that should not be seen in normal use. The reproducibility of these issues depends heavily the circumstances and amount of load that the software is managing. It also seems dependent on the speed of your CPU since that affects the multi-process nature of Windows. 2 potential concerns were found:
If the Auto-Save Interval was executed in very short intervals, timing occurred VERY rapidly (seconds apart), and if data entry was occurring at the same time. Hard case to reproduce in normal circumstances
Movement keys are continually pressed while timing is occurring very rapidly (with a few seconds with multiple timers running).The solution was to improve and isolate the save processes from other running processes, and thus saving after each car in the staging grid works as expected. This is still not recommended since it will thrash the processor excessively, especially for very large events. Slow machines will see this impact.


It looks like we aren't the only ones who lost data with his crappy software!

[Joeyy]

[/INDENT]It looks like we aren't the only ones who lost data with his crappy software![/QUOTE]

Thanks for all the hard work that you put into timing Mike!.. You should never buy a drink if your out with anybody from the Reno SCCA. I'll buy you a pint any day as long as your wearing your pants.

[Dean]

I just checked the site for updates to the timing software, the next version is pre-release, look what I found in the release notes:[LIST]
Potential Program Lockups - ...It looks like we aren't the only ones who lost data with his crappy software!I am not say we were, or that this in some way it is your or Scott's are fault. It is clearly a programmer issue, but perhaps he would realize the problem is more wide spread had we said something when we first encountered the errors.

We are paying for support on this product, and if we don't complain about at least the base functionality that we need not working, how can we expect anyone other than the elite few to operate our timing system?

All I am saying is we have a responsibility to complain about poor SW, especially when we are paying for it, or we have little justification to complain.

[sperry]

I am not say we were, or that this in some way it is your or Scott's are fault. It is clearly a programmer issue, but perhaps he would realize the problem is more wide spread had we said something when we first encountered the errors.

We are paying for support on this product, and if we don't complain about at least the base functionality that we need not working, how can we expect anyone other than the elite few to operate our timing system?

All I am saying is we have a responsibility to complain about poor SW, especially when we are paying for it, or we have little justification to complain.
Excuse me? "Little justification to complain"? That's not how it works. If it's our responsibility to beta test his crap software, he should be paying us. I have every right to complain if his garbage software that we pay for every year is worse and worse with every release. As far as I can tell, we're paying him to make his product cause us more issues. That I can bitch about 'till I'm blue in the face without every sending him a single bug report.

Making his software is not my job, it's *his* job to provide us with a solution that doesn't require us to constantly verify and repair the results without paper timing backup. Hell, in this day and age, it's downright pathetic that he can't write something that doesn't require manual backup.

If I were to write the software for our region, I'd do it for free and there's no way in hell I'd release it if it worked as poorly as the current version of AXWare. You can't even enter people's names in the morning w/o it munching the data. That's beyond basic type testing. How can you release a version of this stuff that regions rely upon without ever even testing entering just two users? There's no excuse for that, other than professional incompetence.

We have absolutely ZERO "responsibility to complain about poor SW" to the author. We pay him, it's his job to make sure it's right *before* it ever gets in our hands. For every bug we find, we should be getting a free year of licensing because he's not providing us with what we're paying for. That's where the responsibility lies.

[Dean]

Excuse me? "Little justification to complain"? That's not how it works. If it's our responsibility to beta test his crap software, he should be paying us. I have every right to complain if his garbage software that we pay for every year is worse and worse with every release. As far as I can tell, we're paying him to make his product cause us more issues. That I can bitch about 'till I'm blue in the face without every sending him a single bug report.

Making his software is not my job, it's *his* job to provide us with a solution that doesn't require us to constantly verify and repair the results without paper timing backup. Hell, in this day and age, it's downright pathetic that he can't write something that doesn't require manual backup.

If I were to write the software for our region, I'd do it for free and there's no way in hell I'd release it if it worked as poorly as the current version of AXWare. You can't even enter people's names in the morning w/o it munching the data. That's beyond basic type testing. How can you release a version of this stuff that regions rely upon without ever even testing entering just two users? There's no excuse for that, other than professional incompetence.

We have absolutely ZERO "responsibility to complain about poor SW" to the author. We pay him, it's his job to make sure it's right *before* it ever gets in our hands. For every bug we find, we should be getting a free year of licensing because he's not providing us with what we're paying for. That's where the responsibility lies.I don't know what world you live in, but the world is full of crappy software from vendors both small and large. If you don't complain to the people who can do something about it, you are wasting your breath and shouldn't have expectations that they will get resolved.

[sperry]

I don't know what world you live in, but the world is full of crappy software from vendors both small and large. If you don't complain to the people who can do something about it, you are wasting your breath and shouldn't have expectations that they will get resolved.
That may be true, but I'll be damned if it's "my responsibility" to do so. The only person responsible is Vitek, since it's his program. I plan fully on making my complaint heard loud and clear the next time the renewal is up and I as a Reno SCCA board member vote not to renew it. Vitek can go straight out of business if he thinks it's okay to pawn off such untested crap on us believing (as you do) that we'll just go ahead and debug it for him. It's not my responsibility... I've already got enough software that is my responsibility. If I were to release crap like he pushes, I'd be fired.

Besides, it's perfectly reasonable for me to expect that as a professional software developer selling software that's basically mission critical to a race region, that he does minimal regression testing. But it's obvious that he doesn't know a multi-threaded application from his own asshole, let alone understanding proper QA processes... so complaining to him is a much bigger waste of my time than simple refusing to pay him any more money. It will never be right.

[Dean]

That may be true, but I'll be damned if it's "my responsibility" to do so. The only person responsible is Vitek, since it's his program. I plan fully on making my complaint heard loud and clear the next time the renewal is up and I as a Reno SCCA board member vote not to renew it. Vitek can go straight out of business if he thinks it's okay to pawn off such untested crap on us believing (as you do) that we'll just go ahead and debug it for him. It's not my responsibility... I've already got enough software that is my responsibility. If I were to release crap like he pushes, I'd be fired.

Besides, it's perfectly reasonable for me to expect that as a professional software developer selling software that's basically mission critical to a race region, that he does minimal regression testing. But it's obvious that he doesn't know a multi-threaded application from his own asshole, let alone understanding proper QA processes... so complaining to him is a much bigger waste of my time than simple refusing to pay him any more money. It will never be right.Since you are not T&S chief, I don't expect you to complain to Vitek, but it was your responsibility as well as mine in the past, and currently Mike's to make sure we have a reliable means of doing timing and scoring for the region. Waiting until our next renewal next March or whenever does not address the current situation.

Unless we want to change vendors, our only recourse is with our current vendor no matter what we think of his product.

[wrxkidid]

kinda OT from what this thread has turned into but i found this picture of the event:
http://farm1.static.flickr.com/216/495382562_431d1a4f0e.jpg?v=0

Coach Dean FTW!

[A1337STI]

hmmf, and i thought someone had an API and we ran in house created software ...


Very nice pic. Man i need a new camera my photos are all blued out and sorta fuzzy (took my camera with me snowboarding one time to many)

[sperry]

Since you are not T&S chief, I don't expect you to complain to Vitek, but it was your responsibility as well as mine in the past, and currently Mike's to make sure we have a reliable means of doing timing and scoring for the region. Waiting until our next renewal next March or whenever does not address the current situation.

Unless we want to change vendors, our only recourse is with our current vendor no matter what we think of his product.
Our solution was to roll back to last year's software for timing, and use Mike's scoring program for standings.

But for some reason, we're seeing issues with last year's version that we didn't see last year... like people that were timed in the morning (and in the backup files) being completely missing from the results by the end of the day. But at least it's not locking up and destroying the event anymore.