Subaru Enthusiasts Car Club of the Sierras

Subaru Enthusiasts Car Club of the Sierras (https://www.seccs.org/forums/index.php)

- Technical Chat (https://www.seccs.org/forums/forumdisplay.php?f=11)

- - Dyno Numbers (https://www.seccs.org/forums/showthread.php?t=1304)

i forgot it was an auto.. and ive worked on the car.. haha. its a really nice leg.. def one of the nicest (and quickest) around

Wait, but if it is being read at the wheels then how is it not what the car is putting out? Sorr I have absolutely no knowledge of how automatics work at all.
Lock-up is where it engages correct? So do they have a set RPM where this is achieved?

Quote:

Originally Posted by wrxkidid (Post 133302)

No, it's the real torque at the wheels. But that's not the actual torque at the motor at that rpm because the slipping of the TC allows the motor to run at a higher rpm than the detected wheel rpm and multiply the torque output of the motor to the wheels. So when the dyno chart shows 300 ftlbs at 2500 rpm, it's very possible the motor was actually turning at 3000 rpm and making 260 ftlbs. So, if you're interested just in seeing what you're putting to the wheels, then the chart is fine, but if you're interested in tuning the engine at 2500 rpm, well that TC means your data is potentially skewed.

TC lockup is relatively consistent, but will vary a bit based on temperature, load, and probably rpm rate of change.

Quote:

Originally Posted by sedonabugeye (Post 133282)

i forgot it was an auto.. and ive worked on the car.. haha. its a really nice leg.. def one of the nicest (and quickest) around

ya Miles came into town and fine tuned it for 4500ft elevation..
he ran his program and est. 255awhp 320awtq now.. did you ever have Ed tune you Andy?

07 sti
TBE
and MBC
Dyno reads close to Ed's
Tuned by me..

Quote:

Originally Posted by cody (Post 51536)

Name: Cody
Car: 2003 WRX Wagon
Mods: Crucial UP & DP, Borla Hush CBE, K&N Drop-In, Heat Wrapped Stock Headers (3rd Cat remains), Intake Silencer Delete, Omori Boost & EGT Gauges, Cobb Protuned by Equilibrium Tuning
Wheel HP: 208.3 @ 6370 RPM
Wheel Tq: 210.8 @ 4050 RPM
Dyno: Equilibrium Tuning Road Dyno (very comparable to the Gruppe-S Mustang Dyno)

Ed of Equilibrium Tuning road tuned my car with Cobb Protune. It was a low 90’s degree day in Davis and the roads were practically baron. We started by taking a baseline pull. Ed commented that my car’s Advanced Multiplier was only at 7 out of 16 so he wasn’t surprised when my car only put down stock-like numbers despite my mods.

He then loaded a base map he had made and we returned to the road dyno. The car came alive like it never had before. The map was damn good from the get go and only got better over the course of the next few hours as he fine tuned it. We did about 10 3rd gear pulls and a couple 1st through 3rd gear pulls and 1 shift to 4th gear. I was surprised how much power the car was making. Ed was surprised how fast my car hit target boost (a hair over 17 PSI). It was a whole new car. No more stepping on it and waiting for the turbo to spool up. Some people have been replacing the OEM boost solenoids with an inexpensive GM one that helps response. The stocker often has a hard time getting to the top couple PSI. My car didn’t have this problem. Ed said it acted like it had a MBC. :cool:

This was the first time Ed has ever tuned a car with Crucial pipes and we think that could explain the better than normal boost response. It was incredible how fast the boost needle would swing to 17 and just stop on a dime every time. He said twin dump DP’s are much easier to tune for than bellmouth. But even taking that into consideration, he was very impressed with my boost response. I think the ceramic coating and streamline design are what make all the difference.

Thank you Crucial and thank you Ed! You both get 10 out of 10. :D

Here's my before and after graphs, overlayed for comparison.

When Ed was up recently, he offered to give my car a checkup down at his shop in Fairfield to make sure that my tune is safe at sea level. So last Friday I stopped by and he was very impressed with the fact that the tune was totally safe at sea level and really didn't require any tweaking at all. He did make a couple tweaks but he said he wouldn't even bother flashing the new real-time map or base map he made me. This was pretty impressive given that this tune was made at 5200 feet. Also, it felt damn fast! Even in 80 degree weather with two large guys in the car and my injectors maxed out, the AFR's were safe and my car felt like a beast. At sea level, the turbo spools up fully by 2.8K RPM and the car feels so torquey!

Big thanks to Ed. I now feel safe romping on my car at any elevation. :D

Car: 2003 WRX Wagon (105,000 miles on the clock)
Mods: Crucial UP, DP and High-Flow catted Mid, Borla Hush CBE, Heat Wrapped Stock Headers, IC Y-Pipe, One step colder Denso Irridium plugs (with like 50K miles on them), Hallman Pro RX MBC (16.5 PSI on the stock turbo), Walbro Fuel Pump, Intake Silencer Delete, Omori Boost & (dead) EGT Gauges, Cobb Protuned by Equilibrium Tuning
Wheel HP: 219.8 @ 6260 RPM
Wheel Tq: 224 @ 3860 RPM
Dyno: Equilibrium Tuning Road Dyno

^That is great to know.

if he calculated at 13, it should be around 252 or so. IMO, just put down what dyno number ya got on that dyno. It doesnt make sense to calculate it. Sometimes its right, other times its not.

I put down 236whp on a DD, and 249 on a DJ. Different days, different temp. Thats not really a 10 isnt it? More like 5-6

Quote:

Originally Posted by Sakast (Post 138910)

What post are you responding to?

I found a pile of dyno charts while I was cleaning up tonight, I thought I would post them all. All the charts are from the same tuner on the same dyno, so they can be compared.

Here is my car totally stock

Fuel pump, catted TBE, custom tune:

Added GT Spec headers (later switched to gruppe-s headers because I couldn't take the sound! They made about the same power):

APS Intake
APS Inlet tube
APS 525 FMIC
APS BOV
GM Boost solenoid
Fuel pump
FP Green 8cm2 exhaust housing
PE 850 injectors
Catless TBE

One graph is 91 octane, the other is 100 octane

Swapped the FP Green for an element GT52 turbo.

91 and 100 octane graphs:

FP Green vs GT 52, 100 octane. There is no comparison! The feel of how laggy they were was even more pronounced on the road than these charts show. The GT 52 was a great turbo!

Right now: Fuel pump and cobb stage 1 map :(

I can't believe how slow a stock STi feels now. When I first got it it was the fastest car I had ever driven :lol:

Here is what I would do if I mod the car again based on everything I have learned:

- I would keep a cat in the exhaust. The tiny difference in spool and power was not worth the extra noise and stinky exhaust.
- Stick to a TMIC ... the FMIC did its job perfectly ... but it was still a giant pain in the neck. Not worth the hassle IMHO.
- I will keep the stock muffler on. I have no idea how much power that would give up, but being the loud douche bag of the neighbourhood got old. It was half the reason I hated driving my car the last couple of years (the suspension was the other half!)
- A smaller turbo is probably better! The car on the GT52 on 100 octane was truly insane. On the street with snow tyres on it is hard to drive in a straight line going up a highway on-ramp. I loved this thing! However ... 100 octane was fucking expensive, and I usually was lucky to get 130 miles out of a tank! On 91 I think the car was actually more fun on the stock turbo. On 91 the small extra gain in power was not worth the extra lag of the big turbo. On 100 octane it definitely was. Also I had a good run with reliability on my engine, although having a fantastic tuner (Mike W. at GST) probably had a lot to do with that ... but a smaller turbo will always be safer for the engine than a larger one.

So I would think long and hard before going larger than a 20g sized turbo, and just stick with 91. Although on the other hand, if E85 ever comes to Reno :devil:

http://i180.photobucket.com/albums/x...ory06wrx91.png
my old 06 WRX with 20g and every supporting mod you can think of!
going through photo bucket and saw it

Nice!

Put it the right format from the first post and I will add it if you want.

Oh sorry, skipped to the last page and missed that.

Name: Nick
Car: 05 STI
Mods: See link http://www.iwsti.com/forums/power-br...5-20g-8cm.html
Wheel HP: (318 ) @ (6000) RPM
Wheel Torque: (332) @ (4750) RPM
Dyno: (Mustang @ DB TUNED)
_______________________________________________

Name: Justin
Car: 09 wrx
Mods: injen intake, tsudo downpipe(catless), 3" to dual magnaflows, stock ecu tune
Wheel hp: 315
Wheel tq: 350
Dyno: Not ran on dyno, ran on laptop during tune by Mayhem Tuning

I have to say, I find it difficult to believe that even the improved turbo of the '09 WRX at stage II can make 350 torques to the wheels.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Kevin M (Post 155266)

I have to say, I find it difficult to believe that even the improved turbo of the '09 WRX at stage II can make 350 torques to the wheels.

Certainly not at reno's altitude.

But you can make a laptop road "dyno" read pretty much anything. Hell, even an actual dyno is pretty hit or miss for accuracy.

Edit: some quick math says 315 awhp = 437.5 hp at the crank... On a stock wrx turbo. I think Mayhem needs to recalibrate his laptop. That's more than just "optimistic".

Anyone know of a cheap awd dyno day coming up?

I'm tempted to do a before and after dyno of my rally car... i should have a lot of options for the before since its still 2wd.

Updated first post for stuff from, well, longer ago than I'd like to admit.

If you are an active club member and I missed yours, repost in the right format or point me to it please and I will add it.

Mike, Did you get a Dyno chart now that you went back to stock exhaust, etc?

I am not going to add all this laptop dyno stuff except stuff from Ed which is fairly realistic.
My guess on some of the other stuff is they are just putting in the dry weight of the car, not the curb with driver weight. If you don't know what your car weighs, get it weighed. On a quiet day, some places that weigh trucks and such like the recycling place will tell you if you ask nicely. (Note where your gas level is)