Think these tire chains will work on STi's?

[dustinr]

http://www3.us.porsche.com/isapi/eng...317&kat=Wheels

[THAWA]

if you had the right sized tires I dont se ewhy not, but why do you need chains? Buy some good winter tires.

[dustinr]

Originally Posted by THAWA

if you had the right sized tires I dont se ewhy not, but why do you need chains? Buy some good winter tires.

Because snow tires suck on ice with a high HP car. Last year I spun into a curb with Blizzaks on and I've been driving in snow since I was 15. We had a few days last year where it snowed and rained at night then cleared up and froze solid. When I went to work in the early a.m. the roads were a solid sheet of ice and my snow tires weren't doing so good; went around a corner and started sliding, couldn't stop the slide and ended up spinning the car around 180 and slid the rear then the front into a curb. Low-pro chains would have been nice and would have saved me a broken aluminum A-Arm.

[THAWA]

i guess that's a good enough reason

[Dean]

Originally Posted by dustinr

Because snow tires suck on ice with a high HP car. Last year I spun into a curb with Blizzaks on and I've been driving in snow since I was 15.

Sorry, I have to comment...

Today's siped tires like the Blizzaks often outperform tire studs and chains on snow and ice.

I don't know how many years is has been since you were 15, but clearly you haven't learned how to drive on snow and ice in any kind of car.

1. Slow down...

2. Use higher gears

3. Don't push any pedal hard, or turn the wheel quickly

4. Slow down

5. Lifting off the gas abrutly is as bad if not worse than braking.

6. For the most part, AWD only works if you foot is on the gas, and the engine applying a positive torque on the drive line. This does not necessarily mean you are accelerating!

7. Slow Down

8. Buying a car with AWD does not exempt you from the laws of physics... Most SUV drivers thinks it does, don't be like them and end up in a ditch or worse.

9. You are not a WRC driver! SLOW DOWN!!!

[JC]

I've never had a problem. I use crappy off-brand snow tires too. The highway patrol offers snow driving courses, you may want to consider taking one.

[Dean]

Originally Posted by JC

I've never had a problem. I use crappy off-brand snow tires too. The highway patrol offers snow driving courses, you may want to consider taking one.

Hey JC. that would make a great SECCS event. Any idea when, or where?

[JC]

Originally Posted by Dean

Hey JC. that would make a great SECCS event. Any idea when, or where?

Of course once I say that I can't find anything. I swear they used to do it when I was in high school.

[dustinr]

Originally Posted by Dean

Sorry, I have to comment...

Today's siped tires like the Blizzaks often outperform tire studs and chains on snow and ice.

I don't know how many years is has been since you were 15, but clearly you haven't learned how to drive on snow and ice in any kind of car.

1. Slow down...

2. Use higher gears

3. Don't push any pedal hard, or turn the wheel quickly

4. Slow down

5. Lifting off the gas abrutly is as bad if not worse than braking.

6. For the most part, AWD only works if you foot is on the gas, and the engine applying a positive torque on the drive line. This does not necessarily mean you are accelerating!

7. Slow Down

8. Buying a car with AWD does not exempt you from the laws of physics... Most SUV drivers thinks it does, don't be like them and end up in a ditch or worse.

9. You are not a WRC driver! SLOW DOWN!!!

Thanks for the tips professional snow driver dude...you're my hero!

First off you know nothing about me so don't assume, it makes an ass out of "U" and Umption.

Secondly the car that I spun out wasn't AWD, it's a 300ZX and the Blizzaks that I had on did very well in snow... but like I said, the road was completely iced over...not black ice! actual white thick ice with very little snow over the top. I don't care if you're Peter Solberg, snow tires suck butt on ice and whomever told you that siped snow tires perform better on ice than studded or chained tires needs there head examined. Here's a challenge for ya, I'll put snow-chains on my Z and you can use siped snow tires and we'll go out on a very large ice skating rink (joke) and we'll see who slides around more. Why bother posting snide comments like above? Does it make you feel better about your self knowing someone might read this and actually think you know what you're talking about. I can post directions on how to fly the space shuttle, doesn't mean I'm an expert. So keep your assumptions and opinions to your self until someone asks for them.

[JC]

I respect your experience here Dustin, but the fact is an AWD with snow tires is prefectly sufficient. I've driven my RS is the snow for years with everything from good snows to bald ass tires that have no traction. The car always makes it through fine with a little finesse. A Z with snows might not be able to handle whatever you throw at it but an STI certainly can.

[Dean]

Don't get snippy with me... you are the newbie here... If you post, we are going to respond.

You wrecked your 350ZX... Clearly you were going to fast for the conditions Mr. driving in snow since I was 15. Period!

You make rediculous statements like "snow tires suck on ice with a high HP car."

We are trying to answer your question by saying Chains are not necessary, or reccomended on the STI.

Low profile chains often offer little in the way of real biting teeth. Relatively smooth metal on ice slides, not grips. Siping is designed to grab the imperfections in the surface.

Chains are not recomended for most AWD cars as they have the potential to damage the differentials, as well as other clearance issues.

I don't claim to be an ice driving expert, but I am a performance driving instructor for the Audi Quattro Club.

So far all we know about you is you spun a car on ice, and think it was because you didn't have chains... It clearly wasn't your driving...

You don't want my opinion, ignore it...

[doubleurx]

What Dean said. I live in Truckee and grew up in New England. Dedicated snow tires and all wheel drive are all you need. Put it this way, up here only tourists and people with 2 wheel drive use chains, and that's only when it is enforced. Dedicated snow tires with all wheel drive is more than sufficient for this area. And when we have r4 controls stay home!

[sybir]

Originally Posted by doubleurx

And when we have r4 controls go play!!

Edited for correctness



Brake cooling mod from last year, up Emigrant trail when it was closed

It sucks, I want real snow tires, but I can't justify them since I don't really ski and my all-seasons will get me to Reno and back passably.

I need some rally tires

[doubleurx]

Sorry Aaron I forgot to clarify, R4 (it may be R3 - I forget?) is a rare control. It is chains mandatory even with AWD and 4WD.

It's the control we see when I80 closes from all the "invincable" suv's going 70 over the summit, then slamming on the bakes on the downhill side.

All lesser controls I agree. AWD with snows is a blast!

[sybir]

I think it's R3 you're referring to. Usually, they close down 80 and 50 under R3 anyways, except for local traffic.

IIRC, R1 = 2wd with chains, 4wd with snow tires
R2 = 2wd with chains and snow tires, 4wd with chains
R3 = 4wd only, chains required.

I think.

[LetItRev]

Originally Posted by sybir

I think it's R3 you're referring to. Usually, they close down 80 and 50 under R3 anyways, except for local traffic.

IIRC, R1 = 2wd with chains, 4wd with snow tires
R2 = 2wd with chains and snow tires, 4wd with chains
R3 = 4wd only, chains required.

I think.

Hey Sybir...you're pretty close but here is what I know to be true for the 3 R's

R1 = Chains or snow tires required (2wd or 4wd/awd)
R2 = Chains required or 4wd/awd with snow tires ON ALL WHEELS, (the later MUST CARRY CHAINS and must present them to the checkpoint worker if asked, or you drive back to Reno and get a set--been there, done that).
R3 = Chains required ON ALL VEHICLES

I've seen R3 called perhaps 2 times through 15 Tahoe winters. It's usually on State Route 28 on Dollar Hill. There is no other way to get from Tahoe City to the Kings Beach, thus R3 will be called. However, most roads are closed before an R3 is called; it is just too dangerous.

I have chained an AWD vehicle, on the front wheels, to get around up there before. It then becomes a "Dodging the other idiots that aren't chained" fiesta-- Slow going at best.

I agree with Nick's statements about chaines. Most people that live in snow country run dedicated snow tires in the winter and don't own a set of chains, if they do, it's only to get past the checkpoints heading home from Reno on I-80.

The key is to SLOW DOWN.

[dustinr]

Originally Posted by Dean

Chains are not recomended for most AWD cars as they have the potential to damage the differentials, as well as other clearance issues.

That's the answer I was looking for Dean, not some smart ass comment about how I need driving lessons. The STi is the first AWD car I've owned since I was 16 when at the time I had a Subaru GL-10 with the pimp daddy kit car dash

So knowing how all of my previous 2wd cars handled on ice with snow tires and how the Z handled on ice with snow tires (I know big difference between the Z and STi) didn't give me a whole lot of faith in snow tire technology with regards to ice, regardless of the car. If your post would have said something about how AWD cars, especially Subes do very well on ice with snow tires and that chains aren't recommended for AWD cars... I would have been educated. I didn't need the " For somebody who grew up driving in snow you're a moron, here's how to do it. The Z is an older 300ZX not a 350 and it's a heavy car with the engine not over the drive tires. So you have to start out in 2nd gear and then shift very rapidly into 3rd when driving on snow/ice. The road I was traveling on was up hill so I had to keep up some momentum or I wouldn't have made it and I had to take a turn on the uphill side of the hill toward the top so I couldn't just come to a stop and then smoothly and slowly take the corner. I was going as slowly as I could and when I turned right the rear of the car started sliding out clockwise so I stayed on the gas and steered into the slide and it kept rotating so I gingerly applied a little more throttle to keep the car off of the left side curb and then like snap over-steer the car spun 180 into the curb on the right side. It was the iciest conditions I've ever seen, seriously like driving on an ice skating rink, the road was covered with a thick white solid sheet of ice, like someone had watered down the road and let it freeze. Not ideal conditions for a front engined rear drive 2wd car. I'm sorry for being "snippy" (sound very Brit).

[Kevin M]

I believe you're only supposed to run chains on the front wheels according to the owner's manual, although that's obviously not good for the diff. I have no plans to ever run chains, but thanks Franz for the tip that I may need them to get through a checkpoint eventually.

[MattR]

My wagon did great in deep snow, on Dunlop WS M2's..

[sperry]

I've got a set of chains for my WRX, simply to get me through the check point. I've never needed 'em, and if I did, I'd just turn around and go home... if an AWD Subaru needs chains, consider the road closed.

[doubleurx]

Originally Posted by MattR

My wagon did great in deep snow, on Dunlop WS M2's..

Gotta love how the cars steering wheel stays oh so steady with that snow packed in the center!

[doubleurx]

Originally Posted by LetItRev

Hey Sybir...you're pretty close but here is what I know to be true for the 3 R's

R1 = Chains or snow tires required (2wd or 4wd/awd)
R2 = Chains required or 4wd/awd with snow tires ON ALL WHEELS, (the later MUST CARRY CHAINS and must present them to the checkpoint worker if asked, or you drive back to Reno and get a set--been there, done that).
R3 = Chains required ON ALL VEHICLES

I've seen R3 called perhaps 2 times through 15 Tahoe winters. It's usually on State Route 28 on Dollar Hill. There is no other way to get from Tahoe City to the Kings Beach, thus R3 will be called. However, most roads are closed before an R3 is called; it is just too dangerous.

I have chained an AWD vehicle, on the front wheels, to get around up there before. It then becomes a "Dodging the other idiots that aren't chained" fiesta-- Slow going at best.

I agree with Nick's statements about chaines. Most people that live in snow country run dedicated snow tires in the winter and don't own a set of chains, if they do, it's only to get past the checkpoints heading home from Reno on I-80.

The key is to SLOW DOWN.

I knew I was off, that's right R4 is when you need to remove all your rubber and install the tank treads.

[BOO]

all I can say is: DAMN I cant wait for the snow.. lol

[BOO]

Originally Posted by MattR

My wagon did great in deep snow, on Dunlop WS M2's..

Matt, You also have to remember that the AWD system on an AUTOmatic is a bit different(Superior if you will) than the Manual..
Ps: You shouldn't have gotten rid of the PIMP Wagon ..

[Kevin M]

Those Dunlop M2s rock... no snow over the summit, but it rained on me for over 90 minutes, and the grip was awesome. I think I'm gonna try to dig up some discount M2s...