AutoX North/South Challenge (May 26/27, Events 6 and 7)

[A1337STI]

Originally Posted by nKoan

Actually, your DNF wasn't clean. There was some radio chatter about you hitting a cone after a DNF .

You could have lied to me you know Ya its more than likely that i hit cones that run, not sure if i had any clean runs on Sunday. I wasn't getting told of cone counts very well (nor were the people who had plenty of clean runs) , which lead me to believe i had more clean runs than i actually did. I'll have to try for cleaner runs next year , and maybe even following the proper course direction ...

First i thought someone changed the course in between runs, " like WTF? Pointer cones at the End of a slalom , that's a first, Oh wait. Crap ... Think i done and got lost here!", then mostly came to a stop to allow that to register, at which point i got moving again!

[MikeK]

Reno results should be done tomorrow sometime. Sorry(esque) for the delay!

[rubberbiscuitt]

we i had a grat time playing cards with my mom, her sisters, grandmother, and my wife this weekend. did anyone see any desert trucks run at yerrington?

[MattR]

Originally Posted by MikeK

Reno results should be done tomorrow sometime. Sorry(esque) for the delay!

Wassup? TIA Michael.

[Joeyy]

I don't need no stinking results. Nick will be leading ESP even with drops but what does his future hold?

[A1337STI]

Reno won, It was a Fun event. And everyone Stayed safe I call that a sweep!

[MattR]

Looks like results are up at renoscca.org...thanks Mike and Scott. It's shaping up to be an interesting points race for sure....3rd in PAX is going to be hard to hang on to...

[MikeK]

Originally Posted by Dean

We think Mike's rear sway is binding, and on the mostly transition course he had a hard time keeping the front not in back.

Last weekend I finally got under the car to regrease my swaybars. The rear bar was so tight that it took all my strength to move it, but the front was worse. I could lay under the car and put my full weight on the end of the swaybar and it still wouldn't budge. No wonder I kept spinning my car. I even spun at the first corner after the start line

All fixed now, but unfortunately all 4 of my perrin endlinks are toast. The crappy spherical bearings on all of them have seized up. Matt, Dean, didn't you guys replace Perrin endlinks with some other brand?

[sperry]

Originally Posted by MikeK

Last weekend I finally got under the car to regrease my swaybars. The rear bar was so tight that it took all my strength to move it, but the front was worse. I could lay under the car and put my full weight on the end of the swaybar and it still wouldn't budge. No wonder I kept spinning my car. I even spun at the first corner after the start line

All fixed now, but unfortunately all 4 of my perrin endlinks are toast. The crappy spherical bearings on all of them have seized up. Matt, Dean, didn't you guys replace Perrin endlinks with some other brand?

Sounds like my car... last week I slotted my rear swaybar bushings, re-greased 'em, and reinstalled them with some washers in the mounts. Now it swings free and easy. I should probably take a look at the front bar as well, but the car's back at GST for tuning this week.

[MattR]

Originally Posted by MikeK

The crappy spherical bearings on all of them have seized up. Matt, Dean, didn't you guys replace Perrin endlinks with some other brand?

Mine did the exact same thing, so I am running the stock endlinks out back. However, I have a sweet setup of homemade parts to run in case they fail..I can show you what to get wednesday.

[Dean]

Originally Posted by MikeK

All fixed now, but unfortunately all 4 of my perrin endlinks are toast. The crappy spherical bearings on all of them have seized up. Matt, Dean, didn't you guys replace Perrin endlinks with some other brand?

Depending on why, you can often get them moving again with the proper application of fluids...

I built some from components that are nylon raced and have studded ends instead of bolts which appear to be holding up. I actually have a few spare sets if you want to try them. No warranties expressed or implied... Much cheaper than anything out there...

[dknv]

Awards pics, courtesy of LVR:
http://www.sb00ya.com/07Hawthorne/Awards/pg1.htm

[MattR]

hahaha..gangsta

[Nick Koan]

Cool pics. I also used my leet hacking skills to find the event photos.

http://www.sb00ya.com/07Hawthorne/Day1/pg1.htm
http://www.sb00ya.com/07Hawthorne/Day2/pg1.htm

[cody]

Damn:

[sperry]

Have you seen the event T-shirt? They're *proud* of not knowing how to set up AWD cars.

Here's a hint, if all 4 tires have power, you want them *all* touching the ground, *all* the time. I know they think they're being clever somehow, but the 3-wheel motion is dubious at best on light FWD cars, nevermind 3000+ lb AWD EVOs.

[Dean]

Originally Posted by sperry

Have you seen the event T-shirt? They're *proud* of not knowing how to set up AWD cars.

Here's a hint, if all 4 tires have power, you want them *all* touching the ground, *all* the time. I know they think they're being clever somehow, but the 3-wheel motion is dubious at best on light FWD cars, nevermind 3000+ lb AWD EVOs.

Not sure you can eliminate it in AS, but I agree in BSP...

[sperry]

Originally Posted by Dean

Not sure you can eliminate it in AS, but I agree in BSP...

An EVO doesn't lift tires on the stock struts at autocross... so Allon's car is lifting the tire because of the shocks he's got. i.e. He's (un)intentionally making the car do it, even in AS. Plus, a big beefy front swaybar would do wonders for that tire lift, and that's perfectly legal in AS.

[Dean]

Originally Posted by sperry

An EVO doesn't lift tires on the stock struts at autocross... so Allon's car is lifting the tire because of the shocks he's got. i.e. He's (un)intentionally making the car do it, even in AS. Plus, a big beefy front swaybar would do wonders for that tire lift, and that's perfectly legal in AS.

You sure? WRXs sure do, and I think STIs and evos might, especially with insanely large tires to keep the outsides stuck to the ground. A front sway may help, but is not going to eliminate all torsional forces on the chassis under cornering loads, and neither will dampers.

Any front weight biased strut suspension car is likely to exhibit unweighting of the inside rear... Take a look at the Hondas in STS or former Neon race series... Don't you think that if they could, those guys would eliminate the inner rear lift?

[MattR]

Allon was on stock struts at hawthorne, his aftermarket struts did not ship to him in time. They like the rotation the car has with that setup.

[A1337STI]

Originally Posted by sperry

Have you seen the event T-shirt? They're *proud* of not knowing how to set up AWD cars.

Here's a hint, if all 4 tires have power, you want them *all* touching the ground, *all* the time. I know they think they're being clever somehow, but the 3-wheel motion is dubious at best on light FWD cars, nevermind 3000+ lb AWD EVOs.

Dude its an Evo its a FWD bais AWD system that can and does send 100% power to just the front 2 wheels. For an STI that is 50:50 to 1/3 Front and 2/3s rear, that would be aweful, but since he was killing it , and since its a FWD bias system, i would imagine that's actually pretty damn clever indeed.

Allon was telling me he sent in those struts into BILSTEIN and had them revalved to his specs. I don't know as much about car setup as the rest. But i know that car can send 100% power to the front wheels only, it seemed he was off throttle when he was lifting up the rear tires too and they VERY quickly sat down as he got on the gas. first day he won by .6 seconds (with tire pax) and 1.5 the next day. (again with tire pax)

[MPREZIV]

Seems like the results speak... our region keeps our AWD cars planted, and we win...

[sperry]

I've never seen an EVO lift a tire at an autocross. I've never seen a WRX do it either, as far as I can remember. I've seen all sorts of FWD cars do it, but that's because they've been setup to, and there is a reduction in rear traction that helps the car turn, though I would think there may also be some issues with consistency in that situation, but the lap times seem to indicate for a FWD car it can be the fastest setup.

If Allon is lifting on stock struts, it's the first time I've seen it. And I can't imagine his driving is smooth if he's able to do that. Granted, his lap times were fast when compared to the rest of the competitors... but remember who we're comparing them against... a group of drivers that get absolutely trounced anytime anyone that's at all nationally competitive shows up.

The STI never changes it's bias. It's fixed by the mechanicals in the center diff. All you can do is change the allowed speed differential before lockup occurs. If the EVO can actually route the torque split, then is much more advanced than the STI system, and I was under the impression that the full-blown AYC system never made it into the US spec EVOs. Either way, so what if the center diff can send 100% power to the front tires... I'd rather have 100% of my power going to the ground through all 4 tires rather than just the fronts. It's twice as much traction!

So anyway, if the tripod setup seems to work for them, good for them I guess. But I'd much rather have a car that corners flat, and allows me to use that fancy AWD drivetrain (and do so w/o abusing the differentials at every corner). If you wanna ride on just the front two tires, get a CRX or something.

[Kevin M]

Originally Posted by sperry

I've never seen an EVO lift a tire at an autocross. I've never seen a WRX do it either, as far as I can remember.

The Evans' WRX (and all DS WRXs as far as I know) lifted inside rears about 5-6".

[Dean]

Originally Posted by BAN SUVS

The Evans' WRX (and all DS WRXs as far as I know) lifted inside rears about 5-6".

As did mine pre mods and on DMS's with street springs and Debbie's did as well as I recall...

Even with my coilovers and race springs, my WRX unweighted enough to allow the rear diff to unlock.

Given the weight distribution of these cars and stock spring rates, the only geometry I can imagine them not lifting is if the front corners reach bump stops prior to the rears reaching full extension. I would much rather lift an inside rear than the transition from spring to bump stop given the choice...