DARKSTI v.Larry and Spencer | 56K = :( - Subaru Enthusiasts Car Club of the Sierras

DARKSTI · 2006-07-23, 09:24 PM

Got to meet Larry and Spencer today, both very cool

He just got his car tuned @ Gruppe-S. His car sounds great, he has Invida DP along with a G200 (FTW!!

). His son also took pics, so those should be up soon.
Now on to the pics, some are a little over-exposed but Black v. SGM is a little hard, I am happy how they came out though.

Full Gallery/Full Res

JonnydaJibba · 2006-07-24, 07:47 AM

Cool spot, nice pics.

MPREZIV · 2006-07-24, 09:41 AM

Awesome pictures!

I suck at taking pictures... Maybe one day I'll ask someone who doesn't suck at it to take some good pics of my car.

sperry · 2006-07-24, 09:47 AM

Is it just me, or does this car look like it's got a front camber issue?

MPREZIV · 2006-07-24, 09:53 AM

that right front looks a bit positive if you ask me, but it may just be distortion in the pic... (?)

sperry · 2006-07-24, 09:56 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by MPREZIV

that right front looks a bit positive if you ask me, but it may just be distortion in the pic... (?)

Even if it's not actually positive, it looks like there's certainly more rear camber than front. And since that's not a BMW, I don't think that's quite right.

DARKSTI · 2006-07-24, 10:00 AM

His wheels were angled a bit, so it may just be playing tricks with your eyes.

Dean · 2006-07-24, 10:02 AM

Maybe, but I think it may be an optical illusion

Also, remember, stock, for some reason, probably rear grip/engineered understeer, the rears get more camber than the fronts, so there may not be much to see.

I think it is 1.5 rear, and 1 or less front.

M3n2c3 · 2006-07-24, 07:14 PM

I couldn't find STi specs in short order, but I did find that WRX sedan stock alignment specs are -0.25 front, -1.3 rear. I'd imagine the STi is similar.

SteveM · 2006-07-24, 08:07 PM

Yeah STi is 30' front 1°40' rear. But both have ±45' tolerance, so you could end up with +15' in the front on the far edge of the range...

sperry · 2006-07-24, 08:12 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by SteveM

Yeah STi is 30' front 1°40' rear. But both have ±45' tolerance, so you could end up with +15' in the front on the far edge of the range...

The factory specs have nothing to do with whether or not that car has a camber problem. If the car has more rear camber than front, I would consider that a problem. The solution is a proper set of aftermarket camber bolts and a good out-of-spec alignment.

No wonder AS STI's have to run 30+mm front swaybars to prevent poor camber while cornering... they start without any negative camber!

Dean · 2006-07-24, 08:31 PM

Problem implies something is wrong. Being within factory specs may not be optimal for performance driving, but that does not make it wrong.

As you are undoubtedly aware, factory specs are about safety, and tire wear.

Take away front camber, and add rear makes the car understeer which is what the factory wants from a safety perspective, and if you rotate tires, wear should even out.

SteveM · 2006-07-24, 09:16 PM

Well, yeah, I wasn't saying it was good cause it was in spec. Merely pointing out that you could be right about the car having positive camber in the front...

Quote:

Originally Posted by sperry

The factory specs have nothing to do with whether or not that car has a camber problem. If the car has more rear camber than front, I would consider that a problem. The solution is a proper set of aftermarket camber bolts and a good out-of-spec alignment.

No wonder AS STI's have to run 30+mm front swaybars to prevent poor camber while cornering... they start without any negative camber!

M3n2c3 · 2006-07-24, 09:38 PM

Really shows you how long it's been since some of these guys were stock.

sperry · 2006-07-24, 10:25 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Dean

Problem implies something is wrong. Being within factory specs may not be optimal for performance driving, but that does not make it wrong.

As you are undoubtedly aware, factory specs are about safety, and tire wear.

Take away front camber, and add rear makes the car understeer which is what the factory wants from a safety perspective, and if you rotate tires, wear should even out.

Actually... I think selling a "performance" car setup to handle poorly is "wrong". Especially since it's done simply for liability reasons.

Maybe I trust in natural selection too much... but if you buy a car like an STI, you should be capable to drive it with respect and skill, which means the factory specs are bogus.

NevadaSTi · 2006-07-25, 09:39 AM

I can drive mine well, its stock. I've had people at tire shops say that I need an alignment because they thought that the rear was out. But, I keep telling them, thats the way they come.

I finally got my 32mm FSB, thats 1 1/4" diameter.

Dean · 2006-07-25, 09:43 AM

While I agree, you know that many buyers don't know any better, are not good drivers, and got it because it is cool. Just like SUV owners who will never go off road much less need to clear a boulder with their rear Diff 14" off the ground...

Those people would raise hell if they wore out the inner edges of their well rotated RE070s in 5K miles. And being the latigous society we are, they can't ship anything remotly "unsafe" from a handling perspective.

The car is pretty damn good in stock form. Heck, it wins awards for it.

Can it be improved upon, yes, but that is what the aftermarket, and performance shops live on.

What annoys me the most is that they do not give you the means to adjust the rear camber at all much less to a reasonable level.

A good street alignment would probably be about -1° front, and -0.5° rear, but even that would likely lead to inner edge wear for mostly freeway driven vehicles.

2006-07-23, 09:24 PM	#1
DARKSTI EJ22 Real Name: Ryan Coulter Join Date: Oct 2005 Location: NW Reno Posts: 372 Car: '07 Jeep Wrangler Unlimited It's not that I'm lazy, It's that I don't care.	DARKSTI v.Larry and Spencer \| 56K = :( Got to meet Larry and Spencer today, both very cool He just got his car tuned @ Gruppe-S. His car sounds great, he has Invida DP along with a G200 (FTW!! ). His son also took pics, so those should be up soon. Now on to the pics, some are a little over-exposed but Black v. SGM is a little hard, I am happy how they came out though. Full Gallery/Full Res __________________ My other car is a Canon Last edited by DARKSTI; 2006-08-20 at 12:11 PM.

2006-07-24, 07:47 AM	#2
JonnydaJibba EJ207 Join Date: Apr 2005 Location: Reno/Sparks, Nevada Posts: 3,482 Car: 2000 2.5RS Class: RestNPeace Master Slurper.	Cool spot, nice pics. __________________ "Why do chicks tell you to call and then not answer....so gay." "Cuz girls are fags I dunno"

2006-07-24, 09:41 AM	#3
MPREZIV Token Real Name: Le Stig Afrique? Join Date: Jun 2005 Location: sitting next to a big yellow box Posts: 3,589 Car: 2001 Impreza 2.5 RS Class: 05 TDSP No, I won't work on your car. F your car*	Awesome pictures! I suck at taking pictures... Maybe one day I'll ask someone who doesn't suck at it to take some good pics of my car. __________________ "...these condoms have a topical anesthetic to reduce sensitivity, so you can last longer. What a paradox. You can't feel a thing, but you can f*ck for HOURS..."

2006-07-24, 09:47 AM	#4
sperry The Doink Real Name: Scott Join Date: Nov 2002 Location: Portland, OR Posts: 20,335 Car: '09 OBXT, '02 WRX, '96 Miata Class: PDX/TT-6 The way out is through	Is it just me, or does this car look like it's got a front camber issue? __________________ Is you is, or is you ain't, my con-stit-u-ints?

2006-07-24, 09:53 AM	#5
MPREZIV Token Real Name: Le Stig Afrique? Join Date: Jun 2005 Location: sitting next to a big yellow box Posts: 3,589 Car: 2001 Impreza 2.5 RS Class: 05 TDSP No, I won't work on your car. F your car*	that right front looks a bit positive if you ask me, but it may just be distortion in the pic... (?) __________________ "...these condoms have a topical anesthetic to reduce sensitivity, so you can last longer. What a paradox. You can't feel a thing, but you can f*ck for HOURS..."

2006-07-24, 10:00 AM	#7
DARKSTI EJ22 Real Name: Ryan Coulter Join Date: Oct 2005 Location: NW Reno Posts: 372 Car: '07 Jeep Wrangler Unlimited It's not that I'm lazy, It's that I don't care.	His wheels were angled a bit, so it may just be playing tricks with your eyes. __________________ My other car is a Canon

2006-07-24, 10:02 AM	#8
Dean Señor Cheap Bastarde Real Name: Dean Join Date: May 2003 Location: $99 Tire Store Posts: 9,294 Car: $.04 STI Class: Fast,Cheap & Reliable=STI Deal, did somebody say Deal? Oh, Dean, yeah that's me.	Maybe, but I think it may be an optical illusion Also, remember, stock, for some reason, probably rear grip/engineered understeer, the rears get more camber than the fronts, so there may not be much to see. I think it is 1.5 rear, and 1 or less front. __________________ I am a Commodore PET --- Now get off my lawn you kids...

2006-07-24, 07:14 PM	#9
M3n2c3 EJ205 Real Name: Jeremiah Join Date: Jul 2005 Location: Dayton, NV Posts: 1,888 Car: 2005 Impreza 2.5RS, 2000 Forester L Class: RNP sometimes (see motto) "Kids are ruining autocross."	I couldn't find STi specs in short order, but I did find that WRX sedan stock alignment specs are -0.25 front, -1.3 rear. I'd imagine the STi is similar. __________________ Small red text that looks curious at first glance but is ultimately inconsequential

2006-07-24, 08:07 PM	#10
SteveM EJ22 Join Date: Apr 2006 Location: Reno Posts: 148 Car: RED WRX Class: Spectator Mangia la mia polvere	Yeah STi is 30' front 1°40' rear. But both have ±45' tolerance, so you could end up with +15' in the front on the far edge of the range...

2006-07-24, 08:31 PM	#12
Dean Señor Cheap Bastarde Real Name: Dean Join Date: May 2003 Location: $99 Tire Store Posts: 9,294 Car: $.04 STI Class: Fast,Cheap & Reliable=STI Deal, did somebody say Deal? Oh, Dean, yeah that's me.	Problem implies something is wrong. Being within factory specs may not be optimal for performance driving, but that does not make it wrong. As you are undoubtedly aware, factory specs are about safety, and tire wear. Take away front camber, and add rear makes the car understeer which is what the factory wants from a safety perspective, and if you rotate tires, wear should even out. __________________ I am a Commodore PET --- Now get off my lawn you kids...

2006-07-24, 09:38 PM	#14
M3n2c3 EJ205 Real Name: Jeremiah Join Date: Jul 2005 Location: Dayton, NV Posts: 1,888 Car: 2005 Impreza 2.5RS, 2000 Forester L Class: RNP sometimes (see motto) "Kids are ruining autocross."	Really shows you how long it's been since some of these guys were stock. __________________ Small red text that looks curious at first glance but is ultimately inconsequential

2006-07-25, 09:39 AM	#16
NevadaSTi EJ251 Real Name: Brian Join Date: Mar 2005 Location: Minden, Nv. Posts: 989 Car: 1994 Toyota 4Runner Some mistakes are too much fun to only make once	I can drive mine well, its stock. I've had people at tire shops say that I need an alignment because they thought that the rear was out. But, I keep telling them, thats the way they come. I finally got my 32mm FSB, thats 1 1/4" diameter. __________________ The last living thing on earth will be me. I'll step on the last cockroach.

2006-07-25, 09:43 AM	#17
Dean Señor Cheap Bastarde Real Name: Dean Join Date: May 2003 Location: $99 Tire Store Posts: 9,294 Car: $.04 STI Class: Fast,Cheap & Reliable=STI Deal, did somebody say Deal? Oh, Dean, yeah that's me.	While I agree, you know that many buyers don't know any better, are not good drivers, and got it because it is cool. Just like SUV owners who will never go off road much less need to clear a boulder with their rear Diff 14" off the ground... Those people would raise hell if they wore out the inner edges of their well rotated RE070s in 5K miles. And being the latigous society we are, they can't ship anything remotly "unsafe" from a handling perspective. The car is pretty damn good in stock form. Heck, it wins awards for it. Can it be improved upon, yes, but that is what the aftermarket, and performance shops live on. What annoys me the most is that they do not give you the means to adjust the rear camber at all much less to a reasonable level. A good street alignment would probably be about -1° front, and -0.5° rear, but even that would likely lead to inner edge wear for mostly freeway driven vehicles. __________________ I am a Commodore PET --- Now get off my lawn you kids...