VA Tech shooting!

[ScottyS]

Speaking of preventing crazy....it's pretty amazing that this kind of stuff doesn't happen every week in this country. Considering the amount of violence in entertainment, the fact that mind-altering drugs, alcohol, etc are in wide use by large "alienated" segments of society, and our freedom of mobility.....

As far as survival skills/instinct.....we just don't have it. Even very basic self-defense martial arts instruction includes emphasis on remaining aware, avoiding conflict whenever possible, and being prepared to use any and all tactics in a "snap" situation like this. I'd rather see that sort of mandatory training in school than a few other .gov-sponsored programs.....we seem to be a collective crowd of cattle.....easy targets. The guy shot up 3+ classrooms, and apparently a silencer wasn't necessary to prevent ambush/retaliation tactics.

In other news, California alone continues to sustain something like 200 murders and 600 rapes per month......

[JonnydaJibba]

Originally Posted by sperry

You may not be able to "prevent crazy" in all cases, but if you know homie is crazy, you can prevent him shooting up a classroom or four.

That's the thing, we do know a lot people are crazy. A lot of people know they are crazy themselves. That's why people take meds, see doctors, psyciatrists whatever. But there are so many fucked up people you can't account for them all.

[knucklesplitter]

Originally Posted by sperry

You may not be able to "prevent crazy" in all cases, but if you know homie is crazy, you can prevent him shooting up a classroom or four.

They are reporting that he was referred to counseling due to erratic behavior and disturbing writing in his creative writing class. There will be more about this I'm sure.



I lay awake last night thinking about all the classes I had in Norris Hall. I think all my ESM and materials classes were there - statics, dynamics, mechanics, materials, etc. They may have been in the same damn classrooms for all I know. Right across the street from Randolph Hall - the ME building where I spent most of my time. I just can't f-ing believe it.

[MPREZIV]

Now that I'm back, my point in my last post was not that there "was" any other option for these unfortunate victims, just that, in agreement with Austin, that I would like to hope some people would have the instinct to to SOMETHING other than what the school adised, which was "play dead". I heard on the news last night, as I said before, that students WERE trying to leap from windows to safety, which just plain makes more sense to me.

And as I alluded, I HAVE stared down the barrel of a gun in the past, on more than one occasion, (I hung with a bad kind of people back in the day...) and on EVERY occasion, I have acted in one way or another. NEVER laid down. I've run like a bitch, and I've attacked a guy who was only an arm's length away. My only point in this paragraph is that I HAVE been in "such a situation" and HAVE reacted in the manner which I described. Defense training or not, I just can't see lying there waiting to die.

Scott's absolutely correct, the point here is NOT "what to do in case of", but "how can we help these 'disturbed' people/stop this from happening again." I personally, have no answer, but I sure hope SOMEONE does!

[100_Percent_Juice]

I agree about laying there. I dont think my fleeing legs would allow me to lay down until I was all the way back home. As far as seeing who is crazy or not. I think most of you will remember the incident up by galena where the guy stabbed his ex-girlfriend like 30 times at the park. No one thought he was crazy. I think he was like captain of the football team and very popular. I believe you can spot crazy in most cases but then there are always those who surprise everyone. Its just sad that this happens.

[MPREZIV]

That's what's scary man. When there's no apparent "sign" or warning that the person involved may be "unstable." You hear most often in cases like this that "nobody saw it coming", and that's honestly terrifying!

[ScottyS]

Originally Posted by MPREZIV

That's what's scary man. When there's no apparent "sign" or warning that the person involved may be "unstable." You hear most often in cases like this that "nobody saw it coming", and that's honestly terrifying!

Precisely why even the most civilized society offers no guarantees. In the end, it's up to the indivdual --- not the gov't, cops, or lawyers --- to be prepared for life's curveballs.

[knucklesplitter]

Does anybody else think it was a bad idea for NBC and others to play Cho's tapes and allow wide public access to them? I may be overly sensitive about it, but having this played over and over again can't be good for the recovery and healing process. Maybe wait a few months? I dunno...

[Nick Koan]

Yeah, I think it was pretty stupid. Allowing him any more TV exposure is just not right.

[JonnydaJibba]

People are fascinated by this kind of stuff. I know I am. This guy was fucked up, like real fucked up. People want to know why or what would drive a person to do something like this. I mean, you don't HAVE to watch it.

[wrxkidid]

i dont understand what can make someone that mad.
36 cali schools were on lockdown today cause some guy said he was going to make VT look 'mild'

i heard someone brought a gun to spanish springs but thats just a rumor.

tomorrow is the aniversery of columbine.

i dont want to go to school tomorrow.

[Duckie]

Because people value their own lives over others you can not blame them for not wanting to be the hero. When someone is pointing the gun specifically at you and threatening only you then the situation is different. You will be more likely to take action when you or someone you have a deep connection with is involved. For all you know the gunman already has his targets set. He may have only killed the teacher who wouldn't listen, the girl who wouldn't date him, and the guy who called him skinny; by being a hero you added one more to his death toll. Further more you attacking him could send him over the edge and make him think EVERYONE is agasint him not just the four he planned on killing.

In these situations peoples survival instict kicks in, the most logical way of saving your life is to at first do nothing, once you see him kill without reason start playing dead. No its not noble, no its not honorable, but its is the intelligent thing to do to secure ones own life. A few peoples instincts tell them to attack the assailent and sometimes not even to save everyone. They just do what their impulses say and unlike everyone else it is not to hide. Often times its the "heroes" who planned on saving everyone who end up cowering in fear and the person who actually stands up is someone you wouldn't expect. Instincts aren't something you can change through discourse.

[Nick Koan]

Originally Posted by wrxkidid

i dont understand what can make someone that mad.
36 cali schools were on lockdown today cause some guy said he was going to make VT look 'mild'

i heard someone brought a gun to spanish springs but thats just a rumor.

tomorrow is the aniversery of columbine.

i dont want to go to school tomorrow.

Yeah, I heard UNR closed down last night for a threat too. Damn copycats.

[ScottyS]

Originally Posted by Duckie

Instincts aren't something you can change through discourse.

Correct. They are changed through training.

Further more you attacking him could send him over the edge and make him think EVERYONE is agasint him not just the four he planned on killing.

Mind reading is not part of the game. If someone starts shooting in a crowded situation, EVERYONE is equally threatened. EVERYONE should be responding as if they are going to die unless action is taken. If that means everyone jumping out windows, so be it, but remaining a still target makes you a fish in a barrel.

Let me qualify --- I'm not blaming any individuals here, and I'm not saying I'd not freeze either. You don't know how you will react until you are placed in the scenario.

What I am saying is that the typical American mentality appears to be one that makes for easy victims, because we are not a society of decisive action takers. We are trained to go report problems to somebody rather than attempt to solve them ourselves. I would rather see more emphasis on preparedess and responsibility in the education system than the typical attempts to avoid it, instead trying to make society a perfectly safe place. Never going to happen, as long as there are people still breathing.

[sperry]

Originally Posted by ScottyS

What I am saying is that the typical American mentality appears to be one that makes for easy victims, because we are not a society of decisive action takers. We are trained to go report problems to somebody rather than attempt to solve them ourselves. I would rather see more emphasis on preparedess and responsibility in the education system than the typical attempts to avoid it, instead trying to make society a perfectly safe place. Never going to happen, as long as there are people still breathing.

+1 Look at New Orleans during Katrina.

[Forgotten]

On the same note, UNR's classes were canceled last night due to some guy talking about going on a "mission" or something like that.
http://www.unr.edu/news/detail.aspx?id=2147

[knucklesplitter]

Prof. Librescu was buried today in Israel. He was the teacher who blocked the door so his students could jump out of the window. He was shot 5 times.
http://www.cbsnews.com/stories/2007/...=mostpop_story

Librescu was at Tech when I was there (him and Loganathan). I looked up my transcript to see if he taught any of my ESM classes, but the profs. are not listed.

[sperry]

Originally Posted by Forgotten

On the same note, UNR's classes were canceled last night due to some guy talking about going on a "mission" or something like that.
http://www.unr.edu/news/detail.aspx?id=2147

Mormon off to build houses in Central America?

[JonnydaJibba]

Originally Posted by Forgotten

On the same note, UNR's classes were canceled last night due to some guy talking about going on a "mission" or something like that.
http://www.unr.edu/news/detail.aspx?id=2147

Jae and her madre were there when that happened. She was a little freaked out about the whole thing, and for good reason. People are just fucked up.

[MPREZIV]

Scotty, very well said. I couldn't have put it better myself.